Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Jesus Christ.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: All right, y'all, welcome back to another episode of Human on the Daily. I am really excited for today's guest. I feel like, Catherine, you're one of those people that I feel like we've met, like, when we meet in real life, we're going to forget that we haven't actually met.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: for my friend Alicia, or our mutual friend Alicia, and then also we have other mutual friends that I'm realizing in Denver. Like, I know Samantha Joy, I've met her very briefly, I know her best friend Christine, like, it's a whole thing. Yeah. So, I'm really excited to actually get to dive in and chat with you about all the things, so thank you so much for joining.
Katherine Rose Woller: Yeah, I'm so excited. We, we've tried to connect for a while, and I'm so happy it's happening, and yeah, I can't wait to get into all the vulnerable, fun stuff of life.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Yeah, so I… I read your book, like, as soon as it came out. Like, if I happened… like, Alicia mentioned it, like, I think right after it dropped, so… and I'm currently planning my wedding, so it might.
Katherine Rose Woller: I see.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: a little weird to anyone being like, oh, you get excited to order a book called Calling It Off? Like, what is wrong with you? But I was like.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: I just… I love, like, sociology and psychology and, like, the… I've had friends call off weddings last minute. I've had people go through and then end up divorced in the first year, like…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: It is a big decision, and I think we should face it with a lot of respect for what it is. So first off, major props for following your truth.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: And a big theme in your book is to trust your gut, and go with what's best for you. So what are… I know you talk about this some in the book, but I would love a little bit of, like, what are one or two specific instances that you think were pivotal in building your trust muscle, and why?
Katherine Rose Woller: So, I mean, first and foremost, the outcome of this, and being able to now trust myself in a way that I didn't in the early days of this season of life, is the best possible gift I could have given myself. It is…
Katherine Rose Woller: such an empowered and aligned feeling to walk around life feeling like you could trust your own decision-making. And I don't know that we always do, and I, as women, I don't think we're always told that we can. And so, learning to do that is the biggest blessing.
Katherine Rose Woller: I mean, there's lots of other blessings, that have come out of that season, but that is one of the biggest blessings for me as I continue to evolve as a woman and as a human.
Katherine Rose Woller: So, I would say, you know, early on, a lot of the… the data points around that were actually the opposite of… of specifically not trusting what my gut was telling me. You know, we… the book opens the day I get engaged.
Katherine Rose Woller: Right? And it's this stunning, beautiful proposal to a person that I did love, I was in this long-term relationship with.
Katherine Rose Woller: And even then, I had these feelings of doubt, that for 11 months.
Katherine Rose Woller: I repeatedly quieted. I repeatedly ignored my gut, I ignored my intuition.
Katherine Rose Woller: And so, finally.
Katherine Rose Woller: A big moment arises. It's actually when I was trying on my wedding dress for the final time, where I finally embraced it, started trusting myself, and then made the decisions to unravel that version of my life. So…
Katherine Rose Woller: you know, I would say I didn't trust myself a lot going into this season of life, and by coming out of it, I very intentionally chose to build that muscle so that I never ended up in that position again, so that I didn't hurt myself and others in those same way again, and so that I could just feel really powerful in my own world.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Yeah. No, I love what you said, because I do think, to a certain extent, women are conditioned to not trust and to look for external validation constantly, and I think what you said about, like.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: hindsight almost being 20-20, of, like, being able to look back and be like, oh, I didn't trust myself, and this is what happened, right? Because we don't realize it in real time, or even if we do, we can quote-unquote justify it in some way, or make an excuse for it, or… I'm actually curious, like, looking back in hindsight.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: How can you look back and differentiate between, okay, that was my intuition saying this was a no, versus this was fear patterning, trying to self-sabotage?
Katherine Rose Woller: Yeah, I think… I think they feel different, right? For me.
Katherine Rose Woller: A, there was a whole physical component of this, of really…
Katherine Rose Woller: feeling sick, and headaches, and tension, and there's a physical component of feeling so out of alignment, and so in mistrust with myself, so I could grow, like, I learned to…
Katherine Rose Woller: acknowledge that over time, and by that point, I was consciously saying, like, I'm not listening, right? Like, I was consciously pushing it down. So at some point, it transitioned from.
Katherine Rose Woller: not knowing I wasn't trusting to, like, purposely trying to serve this outcome I thought I was supposed to achieve.
Katherine Rose Woller: But I think there's… There's just a…
Katherine Rose Woller: A pivotal difference between an intuition, which to me feels grounded and centered, and not constrained by time, and not wrapped up in fear and anxiety.
Katherine Rose Woller: that may be a hard decision, or a decision that is gonna require a lot of change, but I don't think that the intuition piece of it feels so life-ending, right? Like, so…
Katherine Rose Woller: tumultuous, where the fear patterning is exactly the opposite. It, like, preys on that… that time constraint, that societal programming, that fear of response is immediately triggered. So for me, I actually think one feels very different from the other, and if I really pay attention to, like.
Katherine Rose Woller: the racing thoughts and, like, why my mind is spinning, what I'm ruminating on.
Katherine Rose Woller: That's the fear, talking so much more than it is.
Katherine Rose Woller: than if I sit and get quiet and think about, like, what is quietly and peacefully coming through.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Yeah, it's like the… what's the… what's the whisper that's, like, hoping you hear, and if you don't, it's like, okay, alright, fine.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Yeah. I think you said that so beautifully, and I know that that is going to help at least one, if not multiple people listening, because it can be so tough to get caught up in which is which, and I think that's where it can be all too easy to, like, make an excuse, or… right? Like, I can even… this is…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: I don't know why this is coming to mind, because it's the same, same, but also totally different, and not at all the same. So, like, in high school.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: So, growing up in the 90s as a female, right, I think we all got the same terrible messaging on thinness.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: And so I thought it was normal to, like, not eat, and then go work out, and then faint. Like, I had, like…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: I thought that was normal, and I always just like, oh, I just need an extra glass of water, oh, I just need this. And then now, like, I think why I resonate so deeply with what you just said is because I can also look back in hindsight to… I actually postponed my wedding for a year and a half.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: And it was because I kept having fear voices come up, and that spiral of, like.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: oh god, run. When it's just…
Katherine Rose Woller: just like…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: by any… if you know Enneagram 7, like.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: I was just like, oh god, that's a big commitment, that's a lot of pressure, I gotta go. And being able to recognize, like, oh, it's not the soft, quiet, grounded voice, like, that is
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Like, what happens when I can remove myself and take the time parameter away, and then actually listen to what my truth is?
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: So I think you said that so beautifully.
Katherine Rose Woller: But you also have to practice, like, you recognizing that, and…
Katherine Rose Woller: and owning it and working through it, I guarantee you recognize it faster now, right? Like, that practice builds, and with an intentionality to it, I think you can come to that understanding a lot quicker, and have a lot less back and forth and confusion, because it is confusing. Life is full of
Katherine Rose Woller: Big and little choices, both of which have outcomes that you never really know, and it's just…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: It's cute.
Katherine Rose Woller: It's confusing, and so if you can really Practice the intentional
Katherine Rose Woller: discernment between the two, whatever that looks like for you and your body and your feelings, I think it is
Katherine Rose Woller: Such an invaluable… Pursuit.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: 100%, yeah, and I do think that there is… value, too, and I think…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Because, like, it was a… it's a huge risk, right? To call off the wedding and completely pivot into the unknown, into… especially, like, again, as females, and… like, even before you hit 30, but especially after 30, like…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: I don't even know if anyone's watching The Love is Blind, but, like, you can feel the, like, the pick-me, like, I need to get married faster energy, and it's definitely, I think, worse on that show, but we all, too, do feel it to a certain extent, like, it's tough to complain.
Katherine Rose Woller: Yeah.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: from that conditioning. And so I think that there's a certain amount of, like, you almost need to prove to yourself that you can take the risk and come out the other side, maybe not completely unscathed, but better off.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: to be able to look back in hindsight. And so, whether, like, for anyone listening, like, it doesn't need to be something huge, but, like, what's a small.
Katherine Rose Woller: All right.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Take to start to build that trust muscle.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Right? Whether… maybe it's even just deciding, like.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Deciding what's for dinner tonight. Like, make it small.
Katherine Rose Woller: Totally, because they… they build on themselves, and I guarantee you, Everybody
Katherine Rose Woller: I all but guarantee, guarantees are hard. I all but guarantee you that everybody has some facet of their life that they really trust themselves in, right? Whether it's professionally, personally, with friendship relationships, with their health and wellness, with
Katherine Rose Woller: Being a mom, like, there's… there's some place when you really…
Katherine Rose Woller: believe in yourself, and so I really think it's important to, like, feel through how you feel in those moments, and then extrapolate that, because you can take it to another area.
Katherine Rose Woller: And there probably is some place in your life that you do trust yourself enough to, like, just go with it, and so I think it's important to look at the places where you're successful, too, and build from there.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: I talk about that so often, because you can't… like, in the coaching that I do, right, you can't separate career from personal, from spiritual.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: all these different realms of your life, you can't… they're too intertwined. And so if you let one start to override in a positive or a negative way, right, it's going to bleed into the other. So why not pick one that you already feel confident in, and let that… let that trust
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: start to bleed into the other areas, versus the reverse, right? Which is not helpful.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: And I think a huge part of self-trust is breaking free of expectations. And so, prior to us jumping on this call, I sent you kind of, like, a couple questions, and I loved your answer to what's the biggest thing that helped you break free, and it was getting rid of, like, comparisonism, or comparison-itis, or whatever you want to call it.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Can you touch on, like.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: what really helped you? Because I know, like, that's so… so much easier said than done sometimes.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: know it's a process, right? Like, when you first start doing it, you kind of fall back into it, so…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: What really helped you be able to actually break free and let go of that comparison trap?
Katherine Rose Woller: So I think there was a component of necessity, first and foremost, right? Like.
Katherine Rose Woller: I was… during this season, I was 32. I'm originally from Oklahoma, so 32, still not married, still no kids. I was, arguably…
Katherine Rose Woller: behind. So, you know, my comparison scale was, like, way high. I was, you know, I was behind, I thought there were certain things I had to achieve to, like, be valuable.
Katherine Rose Woller: as a woman,
Katherine Rose Woller: And a lot of that comparison was to, like, my ideal life, or my ideal self. It wasn't even necessarily to other people that had things that I wanted, because I think seeing people that have what you want is actually really expansive. It can be a really positive thing, and so a lot of that was something I had put on
Katherine Rose Woller: myself, and…
Katherine Rose Woller: realizing that in order to be happy with my life, in order to find joy, in order to find a self-love, and ultimately, ideally, you know, a loving partner, which I really wanted.
Katherine Rose Woller: I couldn't let comparison steal that anymore. Like, I had to… I had to.
Katherine Rose Woller: prioritize myself, and choosing myself, no matter the
Katherine Rose Woller: burning outcomes, or whatever it may be, in order to find that joy, and so I think
Katherine Rose Woller: You know, it doesn't always take a giant leap, but sometimes going through that fire is really illuminating, and really clarifying, and actually serves you in a way
Katherine Rose Woller: that forces you to take it away. Now, on the other side, I had to purposely not pick it back up.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Right?
Katherine Rose Woller: It's one thing to let it go in service of this season, but then to get through, and through the healing, and then re-entering the dating world, and…
Katherine Rose Woller: you know, really developing into the Catherine I like and know today. I had to purposely not pick it back up, and that's… that's actually, like, a daily reminder. It looks different now. Now it's not…
Katherine Rose Woller: Am I married? Do I have a kid? I mean, spoiler alert, I am married. I have a kid. But now it's…
Katherine Rose Woller: am I a perfect mom? Am I the best mom? And so I think it's… it's again going back to that trust of knowing I'm doing my best, and I believe in my decision-making, and I can't compare it to anybody else's. And so it comes back to self-trust again, honestly.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Yeah. No, I love that, and I love that you really highlighted
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: the expectations that we can place on ourselves versus comparing to others, because I…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: I do totally agree, right? Like, there's a mindset shift that can happen when you're looking at other people, of, like, it can pull you down if you let it turn into, like, oh, she has that, therefore I can't, but really.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: The shift is, she has it, therefore I can too.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: So that's where it can be so expansive, but half the time, I don't think as females, we often even realize, until sometime in our 30s, that we have placed expectations on ourselves, and taking a pause and being like.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: wait, this checklist that I somehow have, like, did I actually create it, or did someone else create it? What… what do I actually want it to look like? And that can be relationship, career, like, anything, right? And being able to kind of… it sounds like what you did is, like.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Like, wipe that slate clean, and start from the beginning of, like, okay, what next?
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: What's gonna feel most true to me now? Okay, cool, let's go for that.
Katherine Rose Woller: And showing up authentically in that way, too, right? Like, It's not easy. It wasn't…
Katherine Rose Woller: popular in that moment.
Katherine Rose Woller: But it was so necessary to the person that I wanted to be that it really…
Katherine Rose Woller: gave… it gave me so much strength and courage to kind of move forward in that way. And now, you know, I have this whole other…
Katherine Rose Woller: reason for continuing to show up that way, and it's my daughter! Like, I have a daughter, and…
Katherine Rose Woller: I am very cognizant of what that
Katherine Rose Woller: already forming checklist looks like for her, and so I really hope that, like, this can be her legacy as much as it is mine.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Yeah. Would it be fair to say that there's, like, some reparenting, then, of, like, being… yeah.
Katherine Rose Woller: Oh, absolutely. I mean, there is, and… And that's…
Katherine Rose Woller: a fascinating component, right? I think especially… as…
Katherine Rose Woller: A woman having a daughter, those relationships are special.
Katherine Rose Woller: And they can be tumultuous, and they can be a challenging relationship with their life.
Katherine Rose Woller: But, the healing that comes from
Katherine Rose Woller: the relationship that I now get to build, both with my daughter and with my mom, is so…
Katherine Rose Woller: incredible and such a blessing. And I'll admit, I was, like, scared having a daughter at first. I was like, oh no! This world is not kind to her, and what am I gonna do, and how am I gonna do this?
Katherine Rose Woller: To the best of my ability, but now it's like, it really feels like such an opportunity.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Yeah, oh, I love that so much. Okay, by the way, she's, like, from the little bit… usually I don't show my face on Instagram, but she's the cutest little girl, and so I'm curious, right, so now…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: I'll call it, like, the beginning of your happy ending, right? Because now, like.
Katherine Rose Woller: Yeah.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: like, the most true version of you, like, you've built a life that you love, you have the husband, you have the daughter. What's something you didn't know you didn't know about, one, marriage and two, motherhood?
Katherine Rose Woller: Oh, gosh.
Katherine Rose Woller: I mean… I think… Entering into marriage.
Katherine Rose Woller: I would say a second time, but I didn't make it there the first time. But entering into an engagement the second time was so…
Katherine Rose Woller: illuminating, because I had these counterpoints, right, of, like, how I was feeling, how I was prior… like, what I was prioritizing. First time I prioritized the wedding, not… not the marriage, and I really kind of got lost in that. And so to see those differences, like, I didn't know it could look
Katherine Rose Woller: as good as it can. I also think
Katherine Rose Woller: You know, the continued effort every day in a marriage, even when it's a wonderful relationship.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Yeah.
Katherine Rose Woller: is still daily.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Here, but you don't… fully recognize.
Katherine Rose Woller: Yeah, and then you throw a baby into the mix, and, like, your whole dynamic changes, and everything shifts, and… that's something I didn't realize about motherhood, I don't think, was how…
Katherine Rose Woller: People say you can get lost in it.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: And I don't think I really understood what that meant from, like, an identity perspective until those very…
Katherine Rose Woller: early days.
Katherine Rose Woller: But not just, like, the first newborn 3 months, like, the first 6, 9, 12 months, like, I didn't realize I wouldn't…
Katherine Rose Woller: feel like me for so much of that, and I… that was a shock to me. And it took a while to, like, come back to that.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: But, you know…
Katherine Rose Woller: all worked out, happy outcome, and I, like, wish I had been a little more prepared for… for that cracking open, and loss that comes with moving from matron to mother, right? There is a lot of self that's lost in that process, and that's not a bad thing, but it is still a loss.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Yeah, no, I think it's the same as with… no, I don't have a kid, so this is speaking from…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: just the work that I do, and particularly the work that I do with letting go of identities and getting new identities, and the grief that goes with that, and something that I don't think is talked about very often, that I could totally see as this true in motherhood, is…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Whenever you're letting go of a title, or adding a new title, or literally any part of you that you thought was going to continue on with you, you have to grieve
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Not only the version of you that is no longer there, but the future that you thought you would have with that version of you, and then the future of pretty much any relationship that shifts at all.
Katherine Rose Woller: Like, there's so much grief that's just this underlying…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: thing that I don't think as a society we talk enough about, even if.
Katherine Rose Woller: You wouldn't change it for the world, even if…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: result is beautiful, like, you still have to move through that.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: that loss.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: and acknowledge it, and accept it, and be able to move through it. And…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Yeah, I love what you said as far as, like, I actually would be really curious, like, is there anything in particular that really helped you start to find yourself again? Because I can imagine it had to, like.
Katherine Rose Woller: in your…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: very intentional once you started to realize of, like.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Okay, how can I get, like, 1% of me back?
Katherine Rose Woller: Yeah. Well… You know, time is precious.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Right? Like, when there are…
Katherine Rose Woller: especially early, like, naps, maybe. Endless feedings, you know, all the fun stuff, but for me, I… I'm a mover. Like, I am a mover to process.
Katherine Rose Woller: I am a creative, I obviously love to write, so those two things…
Katherine Rose Woller: were so important to me, like, A, getting back to a relatively daily movement practice, being very kind to myself at first, because it looked and felt totally different, but just moving, outside, inside, whatever the case may be.
Katherine Rose Woller: changed my…
Katherine Rose Woller: mental health on a daily basis, changed my world. I identify as an athlete, so being able to come back to that in some sense, and finally feeling, like, physically strong, really felt like that re-centered
Katherine Rose Woller: a part of me that I never want to lose, right? Like, that is a part of me that's so important to me. That, and then…
Katherine Rose Woller: the creative outlet of writing, so I've always written. But interestingly enough, I found my publisher, our share friend, Samantha Joy, at Landon Hill Press when I was 3 months postpartum. So, still in the thick of it.
Katherine Rose Woller: crazy timing and decision to do, but, like, we jumped right into, you know, further drafting and editing, and so having
Katherine Rose Woller: having an intellectual fashion project outside of my daily care duties, which I loved and didn't want to give up one for the other, it really just gave me an outlet to feel
Katherine Rose Woller: a different purpose that I think was really important to my sanity and coming back to me.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Yeah, I honestly think… so there's so much that I know people listening can take away from that, even if they're not a mother.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: There's nothing, like.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: you can easily… gosh, burnout is rampant, for starters, and that's, like, a lot of the work that I do, and whether it's burnout from motherhood, whether it's burnout from a career, right? Like, it is so easy…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: to get lost in one quote-unquote identity, or title, or thing, especially with something like a newborn, where it does. Like, there is a lot of time that it takes.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: And so you have to be extra intentional with, okay, what are the parts of you that you're unintentionally abandoning right now, and how can you bring them into the fold, and how can you acknowledge them and show them some love, right? And so I think that's such a beautiful example of, like, okay, let me have a creative project that's outside of this. Let me…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: get back into fitness, even if my daughter's involved, right? Like, how can I…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: it's the… like, I think I often hear, like, I want to get back in shape, or I want to get back into the gym, but I have…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: a newborn at home. Switch it to AND. Like, something as simple as, like, okay, and I have a newborn, cool. Like, that already opens up your brain into, like, how can I make this work?
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Is there somewhere with childcare? Can I just have my baby be the weight that I'm using? Like…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: There's all these different things, so I… I love that example so, so much.
Katherine Rose Woller: I'm like, don't underestimate the power of a walk, right? Like, you can walk with a baby.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Is there a number of times that people forget that as, like, such a powerful reset, even if it's, like, 5 minutes?
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Right? And yes, 100%, you can… you can walk with a baby.
Katherine Rose Woller: What a baby. They like it, they learn, and they are growing, and you are being a wonderful parent.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Yeah, like, I know for sure, because I'm also a mover, so I remember even asking my parents at one point, like.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: the only way they could get me to sleep was walking with me or driving with me, which is mildly problematic, I think, now as an adult, because I can't drive at night without wanting to fall asleep.
Katherine Rose Woller: Let's not do that.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: CNN.
Katherine Rose Woller: So I just… I don't either. I don't at all.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Okay, something… because, again, I feel this can apply to so many different areas of life. The whole, like, grass is greener kind of thing.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: you did a… or you helped with an article recently… I can't remember the title of it, but basically it was, like, European Motherhood, right?
Katherine Rose Woller: Oh, yeah.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: I feel like…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: port… Instagrammable, portrayed version of, like, traveling and being a mother in Europe, and… and you kind of were like, mmm, maybe not. So, I would.
Katherine Rose Woller: Yup.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Love to know… What… that or any other example you have, like, what has it taught you about surrendering
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Further expectations, or any kind of surrender, really.
Katherine Rose Woller: Yeah, so that article in particular, it's for FoodFamilyTravel.com, and it's about, like, the Euro mom trend, which I think is all we saw over the summer was, like, this effortless, chic…
Katherine Rose Woller: Euro mom, and, you know, I have been really fortunate to travel. We want to continue to travel with our daughter. It's part of our identity as a family, and so it is tough, but we do it.
Katherine Rose Woller: And when you take a vacation with a toddler, it is basically a work trip. You are… you are not vacationing from parenting. You are just parenting in another beautiful place, and I think
Katherine Rose Woller: It was really confronting at first to essentially feel like failing.
Katherine Rose Woller: in the middle of this place where everyone's effortless mom. And yet, when you look a little closer, not every French mom was effortlessly handling it. They're having meltdowns, too. There is an element of…
Katherine Rose Woller: letting go. That was really… that's really prominent in kind of that ideology, and, like, making the kids a part of your daily schedule and your daily life, and before that, I had very rigidly, like, lived by my daughter's schedule, and being there, it gave me the opportunity to, like, try on
Katherine Rose Woller: flexible naps, and flexible eating, and just relax, and let go of these stringent standards that I had put on… again, you know, put on myself as what I needed to do, and it just… it opened up a whole world of
Katherine Rose Woller: connection and flexibility that I am not known for flexibility, and so it was really…
Katherine Rose Woller: a really eye-opening experience, but I think there's a lot of things like that, right? I think there's a lot of times when you get out of your comfort zone.
Katherine Rose Woller: by yourself, whether it's traveling solo as a woman, or traveling for your partner with the first time. That's another big one, that you have a lot of expectations.
Katherine Rose Woller: And sometimes when they're not met, like, that's when the gold comes out, and that's when the really cool learning and expansion happens. And so, for me, that was a big kind of transformative moment, and we've brought so many of those
Katherine Rose Woller: Practices and just intentional presence.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Back here, and, like, that's the focus. The presence takes…
Katherine Rose Woller: so much more priority over, you know, a perfect schedule or a perfect day, and I think that was…
Katherine Rose Woller: That's something that I think we can all apply, whatever the circumstance may be.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: 100%, yes.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Kind of in line with that, actually, I feel like… motherhood…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: is very… like, there's so many topics that this could apply to now, honestly, but I'm just thinking, like, from my healthcare background, and then motherhood, like, I don't know if there are two…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: things that have more conflicting messaging, if you Google.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: anything. Like, I don't know if there's worse topics out there for just the amount of conflicting evidence. So, what… for any other, like, new moms or people who are getting into motherhood, like.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: How have you worked on being able to weed through all the info and advice, and just lean in? I know this is going to go back to the self-trust and your intuition.
Katherine Rose Woller: And I'm like.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: How do you make sure that you don't get overwhelmed and you just focus on what's best for you, and then weeding through the information to figure that out?
Katherine Rose Woller: Well, I think the information's an important part of it, right? Like, informed decision-making, it is very much part of that, that trusting your gut. I think information is power, and there's information overload. Both are true.
Katherine Rose Woller: finding sources that you trust and align with, I think, is really important. Finding a community of
Katherine Rose Woller: In this case, moms who…
Katherine Rose Woller: have similar ideologies is really important, because there's… there's judging within mom groups, right? Like, how… how… I mean, I live in Boulder. How crunchy or not crunchy are you? Are you…
Katherine Rose Woller: breastfeed till you're 4? Are you… I'm done at 3 months? Are you co-sleeping? I mean, it is endless, the number of topics that, again, conflicting information and conflicting thoughts on. But if you can find
Katherine Rose Woller: your group.
Katherine Rose Woller: that you… tend to align with, maybe not on everything. I think that is a really powerful
Katherine Rose Woller: Not feedback loop, but…
Katherine Rose Woller: chance to voice your own opinions and process. You know, process out loud, process in community.
Katherine Rose Woller: And then again, take it back to what feels right for your kid, and for you. There are times when I make decisions, and I'm like, this is most definitely in the best service. My daughter's name is Rose, this is in her best interest, but there are also times when I'm like.
Katherine Rose Woller: you know, Science may say she needs 3 more months of breastfeeding, but…
Katherine Rose Woller: openly had a really tough breastfeeding journey, and so when… when it was 8 months, like, we were done. I needed to be done. And so when she started kind of self-leaning, I was like, great, we're… we're gonna lean with this, even though I know there's benefit here, like, I need this.
Katherine Rose Woller: And I really felt like…
Katherine Rose Woller: Being able to trust that, and knowing you're doing your best, and getting, you know, supportive friends and partner definitely helps, but…
Katherine Rose Woller: You gotta, you gotta believe in what you need.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Yeah, no, and I love that you talked about, like, that…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: I don't love the word balance, but that balance between what's best for her, but then also, like, if it's not good for the mom, it's not going to be good for her in the long run either.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: that balance, irregardless of whatever the research is saying, right? Like, trusting your own body and your own needs.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: gosh, even in my 10-plus years as a healthcare practitioner, like, I always came back to, like, no one knows your body like you do, so I can give you advice. What do you feel like is your truth after hearing all the information that I've given you?
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: So I love… and I also love that you brought up the, being able to bounce ideas and process in community, because I think that's so important with so many things in life, right? We're not meant to do.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: alone. We're meant to do it in community, whether it's building a business, whether it's motherhood, like, finding your community and being able to process in real time, and
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Going back to something we said earlier, like, not letting that turn into external validation.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: opinions, but just processing and then running it through your own internal litmus test of, like, okay, cool, now what's.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: After hearing all of this. What feels right for me?
Katherine Rose Woller: It's… it takes time, I will say, to find that, whether you've moved or whether you're changing life phases when your life changes and you enter a new phase.
Katherine Rose Woller: there's a natural falling off of some of those relationships, and there's a natural blossoming of new relationships that now suit this phase in your life, and I think both pieces are really important, and you have to continue to nurture that connection and that community. It really serves a benefit across the board.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Yes. No, I love that. Going back to… so I kind of mentioned that I don't love the word balance. I think balance is BS. I think it's…
Katherine Rose Woller: Oh, my.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: My personal opinion is that it's a little bit more of, like, okay, what needs to be the focus, like, right in this moment?
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: That'll shift.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: And there's, like, an ebb and a flow, is a little bit more accurate, the balance. So, as you started to find yourself and get into create, like, your own creative project and get back into fitness, like.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: How did you find, or are you still trying to find, that ebb and flow?
Katherine Rose Woller: It changes with every new…
Katherine Rose Woller: not even, like, physical season, but every new season arose, you know, as… as… as teething changes, as naps change, as we're learning to walk. I mean, she now… she's, like.
Katherine Rose Woller: over a year and a half now, so she just runs everywhere, literally, all the time. But…
Katherine Rose Woller: But every one of those milestones changes something about your day-to-day and the needs of a kiddo. So, like, there were weeks when I would tell the editors, like, I actually will not meet this deadline. Like, things are happening such at home that, like, to your point, like, this is my priority today.
Katherine Rose Woller: this will be a priority as soon as I sort this out. And, like, thank you for your patience and grace. But I think it was… it was really… it's shifting that focus, and…
Katherine Rose Woller: understanding
Katherine Rose Woller: the ebb and flow is natural and… and normal, and I will have another ebb and flow. Like, I've come back into this new…
Katherine Rose Woller: version of me where my daughter is in
Katherine Rose Woller: Montessori for a few hours in the morning. I have time to, like, really hit the gym again.
Katherine Rose Woller: write more articles, like the one that you mentioned. And, you know, surprise, by the time this comes out, I'm now pregnant again. So, like, things are… things are gonna change again, thank you, and, like.
Katherine Rose Woller: And that's gonna…
Katherine Rose Woller: ebb and flow with my career as that all changes, and so it's just… I don't find it easy every day to embrace that, but in the grand scheme of things, like.
Katherine Rose Woller: Really leaning into the fluidity.
Katherine Rose Woller: And not trying to have balance.
Katherine Rose Woller: Right? Like, imbalance is futile. I will not find it. So, just understanding…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: This is why they were fed growing up that you're supposed to… anyways, I won't get on that soapbox too far.
Katherine Rose Woller: I'm with you on the soapbox, because it's not going to happen for me.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Yeah, and I think everything that you said speaks so much to various points that we've already touched on, on, like, having your community, right? And that includes having the people in your corner for the creative project, and for… and, like, your partner, like, everyone that's involved.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Having the right people who aren't going.
Katherine Rose Woller: Jeez.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: and they are going to have patience with, like, hey, I'm not going to meet this deadline, right?
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: I think that speaks so strongly to the
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: When you stand more in your truth, and when you trust yourself enough to be able to…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Be honest with…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: like, hey, no, I'm not gonna be able to… I need to… I need to shift this. Like, I know I said this, but can we pivot?
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: and trusting yourself, giving yourself the grace, like, the more you do that, the more… it's… I feel like it's almost like a chicken and the egg thing. Like, the more that you do that, the more the right people are gonna come into your world.
Katherine Rose Woller: Hmm.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: More the right people are in your world, the more comfortable you feel with, like, having that relationship and fostering not only the relationship with them, but the internal relationship with yourself.
Katherine Rose Woller: Right, and that vulnerability is so powerful. Like, that's… that's how we connect as… as people, whether it's in a professional sense or in a personal sense. Like, the vulnerability is what makes us human.
Katherine Rose Woller: And that's where we see ourselves in each other, and that's where we can be generous with each other, and that's what leads to, like, a real meaningful relationship. And so, the more you can be vulnerable about
Katherine Rose Woller: Maybe falling, quote-unquote short, like… The better it serves you in the long run.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Yeah.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: No, 100%.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Okay.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: How… last question, how has the self-trust that you've cultivated Been further, like, What's, like, the next…
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Test and expansion that you can feel coming on right now.
Katherine Rose Woller: I mean…
Katherine Rose Woller: part of it is… is as my daughter grows and matures and tests boundaries like she's supposed to, I think that there will be… there will be challenges there, right? Like, that relationship is going to change and evolve.
Katherine Rose Woller: and what she needs from me as mom is gonna change, what I'm able to give as mom is gonna change, and so I think
Katherine Rose Woller: that… that's gonna be a trying time, you know? As kids get bigger, problems get bigger, and being able to trust yourself through that process, for me, is definitely one of the… the big challenges, you know, moving forward. I also think…
Katherine Rose Woller: you know, with this second edition of A Little Peanut, we,
Katherine Rose Woller: like, trusting the change in our family dynamic, right? And how to… how to navigate that, I think, as the mom.
Katherine Rose Woller: in our family, like, I hold a lot of the glue.
Katherine Rose Woller: Right? Like, I am a lot of the ties, and so feeling confident in how we, you know, restructure our family is an immediate test that I'm like, okay, I'm really gonna have to lean in to my trust here, and believe that I'm doing this the very best that I possibly can.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Yes.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Yeah, I… and it really is, it's crazy, and I'm sure this will be the case for you, right? Of, like, almost having to lean on past experience from, like, okay, I've made it through hard things before, I can do it again.
Katherine Rose Woller: every time you come through that, it's… A, I'm amazed at what we make it through, and then, like, almost never look back on, right? Like, we don't inhabit that same angst again. You will most likely not inhabit the same level of intense angst, even when you think back to, like, a past season, or even when you kind of re-feel it.
Katherine Rose Woller: And I'm always fascinated by how much faster things get better on the other side of whatever this difficult situation is.
Katherine Rose Woller: How much faster it gets better than we think is possible.
Katherine Rose Woller: Right? Like, we torture ourselves… I forget who said it, but, like, we torture ourselves more in our own mind than ever happens in reality, and I think that that is so true.
Katherine Rose Woller: And this is kind of one of those same situations, so looking back on everything you've come through, we've all been through challenges, whatever they may be, and seeing
Katherine Rose Woller: the beauty on the other side. I know it sounds trite, but, like, that is hope.
Katherine Rose Woller: Right? And I think you have your own evidence of the hope from the past, and I hope that that gives people, you know, a continued hope for the future.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Yeah.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Yeah, no, I love that. Like, looking at Past Hope to almost compile it.
Katherine Rose Woller: Yeah.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: you forward.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Okay, Catherine, thank you so much. I would love…
Katherine Rose Woller: Oh my gosh.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: I'll put all the links below, but, like, share.
Katherine Rose Woller: Sure.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: And you… all that fun stuff.
Katherine Rose Woller: Totally. So, if you're interested in the book, or it speaks to you for your personal seasonal life, it's called Calling It Off, Memoir of an Almost Bride. It's obviously available on Amazon, it's also available on, like, the online ordering through any of your local independent bookstores. You can also ask personally, hey, order this for me and support an indie that you love.
Katherine Rose Woller: There is an audiobook that goes with it that I narrated, so it's me telling you the story in my voice. It's on Audible.
Katherine Rose Woller: And then if you can find me, I am at Katherine Waller on Instagram. I really only do one social media, because it's all I have time for, and I refuse to do more. But then my website is… I just can't. My website is KatherineRoseWaller.com, and I do have, you know, a free resource for if you are at a
Katherine Rose Woller: A big crossroads in life, and you want…
Katherine Rose Woller: some strategies to try to think through that. It's 3 simple questions I asked myself through the entirety of this experience, and continue to on a daily basis, and that's right there, and it's totally free.
Katherine Rose Woller: And then I… I love to kind of send regular updates on what's happening, so…
Katherine Rose Woller: Come send me a message.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Sweet.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: I love that so much. Okay, all those links will be below. Catherine, again, thank you so, so much. I absolutely loved this conversation, and I just adore you, and I can't wait until we meet in real life.
Katherine Rose Woller: So soon.
Katherine Rose Woller: So soon, please. Yeah.
Dr. Megan - Career Alignment & getting regulated @drmegandaley: Okay. Alrighty, y'all, catch ya next time.
